The Breakthrough - Human thinking is changing

[drbubb]

STRANGE TALE: Terrence McKenna, the I-ching, and the Mayan Calendar

 

[sine270]

Interesting though. He's not an easy guy to understand. What I thought he was saying is that he had visions during magic mushroom sessions which made him understand what the Mayans understood.

 

What do you reckon? Is there anything worthwhile to be learned from psychodelics? I heard that giving magic mushrooms to the terminally ill had a miraculously positive effect on their psyche.

[John Doe]

Interesting though. He's not an easy guy to understand. What I thought he was saying is that he had visions during magic mushroom sessions which made him understand what the Mayans understood.

 

What do you reckon? Is there anything worthwhile to be learned from psychodelics? I heard that giving magic mushrooms to the terminally ill had a miraculously positive effect on their psyche.

 

Oh, not just the termanily ill, I thought they were great (I had never seen a cow smile before ), but a friend of mine ended up in hospital cos he thought his quilt was trying to eat him . Didn't have any more after that.

 

Of course, we were very young and daft at the time

[sine270]

Oh, not just the termanily ill, I thought they were great (I had never seen a cow smile before ), but a friend of mine ended up in hospital cos he thought his quilt was trying to eat him . Didn't have any more after that.

 

Of course, we were very young and daft at the time

 

Maybe the cow really was smiling only you dont normally see it.

Young and daft people drive cars too with the results often not good then either.

[John Doe]

Maybe the cow really was smiling only you dont normally see it.

Young and daft people drive cars too with the results often not good then either.

 

Perhaps it was

 

(Oh, we were far too young to have cars back then)

[BoldAsBrass]

STRANGE TALE: Terrence McKenna, the I-ching, and the Mayan Calendar

 

 

I listened to that, twice, admittedly while writing software ... what is he talking about?

 

He mentions that he arrived at the same date as a Mayan calendar's end date? How did he arrive at the date? He seemed to be going on about an amazing coincidence - that he had done something, or derived something, that came up with the same end date as a Mayan calendar - but I didn't 'get' what it was he says he did to arrive at it?

 

Can anyone explain?

[sine270]

Perhaps it was

 

(Oh, we were far too young to have cars back then)

 

So why not try again now that you are older and more educated?

 

Not that I've read all the posts that you and Bubb have fired back and forward but I can see that you like everything to have a scientific explanation and you are quick to poo poo anything that some would see as "unexplained".

[BoldAsBrass]

Oh, not just the termanily ill, I thought they were great (I had never seen a cow smile before ), but a friend of mine ended up in hospital cos he thought his quilt was trying to eat him . Didn't have any more after that.

 

Of course, we were very young and daft at the time

 

I was never into drugs myself - but, being of the hippie generation, most of my mates were. I remember when I was about 15 being round my mate's house when he chopped up a banana skin into little pieces and cooked it. Quite what the process was escapes my memory, but the burnt remains ended up in a rolled up cigarette - which my mate duly smoked.

 

Although the exact process has, as I say, escaped my memory - but the sound of his puking afterwards lives with me yet. I thought he was going to turn himself inside out. 'Feck that' I thought to myself - mind you, I never have liked bananas.

[sine270]

I listened to that, twice, admittedly while writing software ... what is he talking about?

 

He mentions that he arrived at the same date as a Mayan calendar's end date? How did he arrive at the date? He seemed to be going on about an amazing coincidence - that he had done something, or derived something, that came up with the same end date as a Mayan calendar - but I didn't 'get' what it was he says he did to arrive at it?

 

Can anyone explain?

 

 

I also listened to it twice (admittedly while watching tv). I think you understood correctly but he did make it very confusing.

He says he arrived by this end date by taking psychodelic mushrooms (or possibly ayahuasca knowing him). What he refuses to say is how he was told.

[John Doe]

So why not try again now that you are older and more educated?

 

Because at that time, I didn't have a care in the world. Now, older and with responsibilities, (and from knowing enough others that have tried such things again, later in life), I'd end up paranoid and on a bad trip .

 

Not that I've read all the posts that you and Bubb have fired back and forward but I can see that you like everything to have a scientific explanation and you are quick to poo poo anything that some would see as "unexplained".

 

Not at all. I just try to separate philosophical theories from scientific theories. That's all. There is a place for both.

 

What I poo poo is those who try to use science (and scientific terminology) to claim things which are clearly not scientific and have not been studied in a scientific manner. There is a difference.

[sine270]

Because at that time, I didn't have a care in the world. Now, older and with responsibilities, (and from knowing enough others that have tried such things again, later in life), I'd end up paranoid and on a bad trip .

 

I'm not so sure that a bad trip is any more harmful than a bad dream. Perhaps it would make one question things a bit more which would surely be a good thing.

As for paranoid, it seems unlikely to happen to a normally balanced person. It implies the opening of a door that cannot be closed again which probably does happen to some. Perhaps in the case of "Schizophrenic" people who seem to shout out at noone perhaps that is what has happened.

 

 

 

Not at all. I just try to separate philosophical theories from scientific theories. That's all. There is a place for both.

 

What I “poo poo” is those who try to use science (and scientific terminology) to claim things which are clearly not scientific and have not been studied in a scientific manner. There is a difference.

 

That makes sense to me. Its a pity there's not more scientific study into things which haven't yet been understood properly.

 

In the case of breakthoughs in human thinking and expanded consciousness etc this would be a difficult study as there will be few who have ever achieved such a state. Any who have are apparently reluctant to take part in a study.

What I believe is that one cannot take much very seriously what is written about this, and if you really want to know about it then its necessary to take steps in the process towards a personal awakening so you can see it for yourself.

Yoga, meditation etc is a good starting point.

[John Doe]

I'm not so sure that a bad trip is any more harmful than a bad dream. Perhaps it would make one question things a bit more which would surely be a good thing.

As for paranoid, it seems unlikely to happen to a normally balanced person. It implies the opening of a door that cannot be closed again which probably does happen to some. Perhaps in the case of "Schizophrenic" people who seem to shout out at noone perhaps that is what has happened.

 

Maybe I'm a bit strange then , as in my later years of smoking herb (before I stopped all such things), it used to make me a bit paranoid I can tell you (One of the reasons I stopped).

 

However, no symptoms nowadays (or lasting effects that I can tell), must be the clean and healthy lifestyle I lead nowadays no doubt

 

I also know that feelings of paranoia can be induced with strong electric and magnetic fields etc. There is a device that(AFAIR) is called the heaven and hell chamber that they put on your head and vary the mag and elec fields. It can make you think there is someone (something) behind you (in an empty room) etc. They even suggested that certain cellars (old castles etc) built in areas with magetic rocks nearby, might explain some of the "haunted" feelings some people get.

 

However, speaking for myself, even on good trips I was always fully aware that what I was experiencing (seeing) was not real. For example, I once watched my cupboard door burn (the paint seemed to be peeling off etc), yet I knew it was not on fire and that it was just my mind playing tricks. The mind is a powerful thing (just think of some of the "real" dreams you've had), and it can easily confuse us.

 

However, most of the time it's quite simple to test what you are perceiving.

[last_ninja]

The Paratopia podcast interviewed Terrence's brother, Dennis McKenna:

 

http://paratopia.org/?page_id=10

 

I like Paratopia, it has a good mix of humour and scepticism while exploring a lot of ideas. There's an interesting episode on the subject of ayahuasca (the Brandon D one) too.

 

I had such a crazy nightmare when I fell asleep listening to that one. They mention a common theme in ayahuasca trips is a sense that there is some kind of demonic parasite always with us wrapped around our soul that we're not normally aware of, it's so familiar that we don't distinguish it from ourselves. I was asleep as I heard this but lucid and I thought if you can see this demon in altered states perhaps you can see it when asleep so I sort of turned inside my head to look for it, and there it was. I completely freaked and tried to wake up and sleep paralysis kicked in which I interpreted as this demon locking me down as some kind of demonstration of power.

 

Eventually I shook myself awake but I was still convinced it was real and that feeling just gradually faded. I'm still confused as to why I thought it was so real after I awoke. The dreams associated with my sleep paralysis episodes get more elaborate every time.

[John Doe]

The Paratopia podcast interviewed Terrence's brother, Dennis McKenna:

 

http://paratopia.org/?page_id=10

 

I like Paratopia, it has a good mix of humour and scepticism while exploring a lot of ideas. There's an interesting episode on the subject of ayahuasca (the Brandon D one) too.

 

I had such a crazy nightmare when I fell asleep listening to that one. They mention a common theme in ayahuasca trips is a sense that there is some kind of demonic parasite always with us wrapped around our soul that we're not normally aware of, it's so familiar that we don't distinguish it from ourselves. I was asleep as I heard this but lucid and I thought if you can see this demon in altered states perhaps you can see it when asleep so I sort of turned inside my head to look for it, and there it was. I completely freaked and tried to wake up and sleep paralysis kicked in which I interpreted as this demon locking me down as some kind of demonstration of power.

 

Eventually I shook myself awake but I was still convinced it was real and that feeling just gradually faded. I'm still confused as to why I thought it was so real after I awoke. The dreams associated with my sleep paralysis episodes get more elaborate every time.

 

 

Yep, I had a horrible dream about nuclear war when the air raid warning sirens malfunctioned at about 6 in the morning, and went on for about 10 minutes. (Yes, we used to have them all around the UK and they used to test them every 6 months or so, even during the end of the cold war, but they would normally sound once and stop).

 

Apparently, loads of people ran out into the street as they thought it was WW3. However, I was young at the time and slept through the whole thing.

 

But, while I was asleep, I incorporated it into my dream. Scariest dream I’ve ever had, woke up real scared.

 

I still remember that dream vividly today.

[drbubb]

wrong thread

[BoldAsBrass]

The Paratopia podcast interviewed Terrence's brother, Dennis McKenna:

 

http://paratopia.org/?page_id=10

 

I like Paratopia, it has a good mix of humour and scepticism while exploring a lot of ideas. There's an interesting episode on the subject of ayahuasca (the Brandon D one) too.

 

I had such a crazy nightmare when I fell asleep listening to that one. They mention a common theme in ayahuasca trips is a sense that there is some kind of demonic parasite always with us wrapped around our soul that we're not normally aware of, it's so familiar that we don't distinguish it from ourselves. I was asleep as I heard this but lucid and I thought if you can see this demon in altered states perhaps you can see it when asleep so I sort of turned inside my head to look for it, and there it was. I completely freaked and tried to wake up and sleep paralysis kicked in which I interpreted as this demon locking me down as some kind of demonstration of power.

 

Eventually I shook myself awake but I was still convinced it was real and that feeling just gradually faded. I'm still confused as to why I thought it was so real after I awoke. The dreams associated with my sleep paralysis episodes get more elaborate every time.

 

Isn't that 'demonic parasite' just the 'other' you? My other me wants to kill me - slowly - but surely nonetheless. When I eat too much (my biggest failing I guess, on the self control front) - and put on weight - the other me thinks it is great. When I diet and exercise - the other me is saying all the time 'go on, one bloody biscuit can't hurt, it's cold outside, what do want to go cycling in the dark and rain for ... etc.

 

My youngest brother's 'other me' talked him into drinking himself to death.

 

The 'other me' turns ordinarily decent people into people who will herd women and children into gas chambers - when the conditions are extreme enough.

 

I'm really glad in my lifetime I've never had to do the soldiering thing that most generations before me have had to try their hand at. Who knows what would pop out of you when there are no rules anymore.

 

But to think of the other you as a demonic parasite wrapped around your soul - well that's a bit scary - but probably a good analogy. You're born, you want to live life in a decent way, do no harm and do some good - but the other fecker constantly tries to pull you down.

 

I am in no way religious - but it does seem to me we all have God and the Devil in us.

[John Doe]

Isn't that 'demonic parasite' just the 'other' you? My other me wants to kill me - slowly - but surely nonetheless. When I eat too much (my biggest failing I guess, on the self control front) - and put on weight - the other me thinks it is great. When I diet and exercise - the other me is saying all the time 'go on, one bloody biscuit can't hurt, it's cold outside, what do want to go cycling in the dark and rain for ... etc.

 

My youngest brother's 'other me' talked him into drinking himself to death.

 

The 'other me' turns ordinarily decent people into people who will herd women and children into gas chambers - when the conditions are extreme enough.

 

I'm really glad in my lifetime I've never had to do the soldiering thing that most generations before me have had to try their hand at. Who knows what would pop out of you when there are no rules anymore.

 

But to think of the other you as a demonic parasite wrapped around your soul - well that's a bit scary - but probably a good analogy. You're born, you want to live life in a decent way, do no harm and do some good - but the other fecker constantly tries to pull you down.

 

I am in no way religious - but it does seem to me we all have God and the Devil in us.

 

Wow, I know just what you mean BaB.

 

Just like in National Lampoons Animal House?

 

http://www.traileraddict.com/clip/animal-house/red-band-clip-angel-vs-devil

 

[drbubb]

If Einstein was wrong (about the speed of light),

are we about to get some important new answers ?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVycq0OTXqo

[drbubb]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cK4F9VQEF3A

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV5CIAltc9M

[drbubb]

VERITAS Magazine Releases the First of a Three-part Interview with Reknown Physicist and Quantum Activist Dr. Amit Goswami

 

VERITAS, Australia’s leading consciousness magazine, announces the first of a three-part interview with Dr. Amit Goswami, a visionary in the convergence of quantum physics and spirituality, appearing in the latest issue (Volume 2, Issue 6) on newsstands now.

 

(PRWEB) December 06, 2011

 

During the lengthy talk with VERITAS Executive Editor and Publisher Brian J. Creigh, Goswami offered this groundbreaking premise: “Quantum physics suggests that consciousness, not matter, is the ground of being.”

 

From this important thesis, the interview covers a range of fascinating topics including the existence of God within science; the current popularity of what Goswami refers to as “fact-free science;” his “creative evolution” theory that speaks to the limitations of Darwinism; and the surprising link between creativity and a Frank Sinatra song.

 

For over 30 years, Goswami taught physics at the University of Oregon’s Institute of Theoretical Science and he now dedicated his time writing books and lecturing. And as a pioneer in the nascent field of Quantum Activism— the idea of changing our realities in accordance with the principles of quantum physics, through consciousness—Goswami’s insights on in demand.

 

Goswami has made memorable appearances on the silver screen including award-winning documentaries such as “What the #$*! Do We (K)now!?” (2004), “Dalai Lama Renaissance” (2007) and “The Quantum Activist” (2009). Goswami has collaborated many times with Deepak Chopra, most recently on their 2009 book, The Quantum Physics of Soul and Spirit, which discusses the impact of quantum physics on spirituality. Chopra has called Goswami, “one of the most brilliant minds in the world of science,” and that “his insights into the relationship between physics and consciousness have deeply influenced my understanding.”

 

Turning the page, readers find that each issue of VERITAS covers essential topics the mainstream media fails, and fears, to cover. David Icke—chief proponent of the theory that says the global economy is controlled by inbred part-god, part-human reptiles—continues to challenge conventional thought by uncovering the “astral level” of the New World Order’s agenda against humanity; the cosmic Internet (yes, he says, there is one) and Illuminati Bloodlines. If you are a citizen of the universe, you’ll want to know what this man knows.

 

/more: http://www.prweb.com/releases/2011/12/prweb9012597.htm

[John Doe]

VERITAS Magazine Releases the First of a Three-part Interview with Reknown Physicist and Quantum Activist Dr. Amit Goswami

 

VERITAS, Australia’s leading consciousness magazine, announces the first of a three-part interview with Dr. Amit Goswami, a visionary in the convergence of quantum physics and spirituality, appearing in the latest issue (Volume 2, Issue 6) on newsstands now.

 

Turning the page, readers find that each issue of VERITAS covers essential topics the mainstream media fails, and fears, to cover. David Icke—chief proponent of the theory that says the global economy is controlled by inbred part-god, part-human reptiles—continues to challenge conventional thought by uncovering the “astral level” of the New World Order’s agenda against humanity; the cosmic Internet (yes, he says, there is one) and Illuminati Bloodlines. If you are a citizen of the universe, you’ll want to know what this man knows.

 

/more: http://www.prweb.com/releases/2011/12/prweb9012597.htm

 

Quantum activists The next "big" thing?

 

And what's a "Reknown physicist"?

 

So Dr. Amit Goswami was a physicist at University of Oregon’s Institute of Theoretical Science for 30 years, and still didn't made Prof ? Interesting

 

Those that either don't understand, or worse, actively try to fool people with quantum theory terms, are peddling nonsense that...

 

amount to little more than what California Institute of Technology physicist and Nobel laureate Murray Gell-Mann once described as "quantum flapdoodle."

 

University of Oregon quantum physicist Amit Goswami, for example, says in the film: "The material world around us is nothing but possible movements of consciousness. I am choosing moment by moment my experience. Heisenberg said atoms are not things, only tendencies."

 

Okay, Amit, I challenge you to leap out of a 20-story building and consciously choose the experience of passing safely through the ground's tendencies.

 

Says it all really doesn't it.

 

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=quantum-quackery

 

"Quantum Flapdoodle"

 

Brilliant turn of phrase from Gell-Mann, (was also known to have an amazing grasp of language and pronunciation).

 

Science is science, philosophy is not. Each has it's place, but don't risk your life jumping out a window when testing which is which

[sine270]

The Paratopia podcast interviewed Terrence's brother, Dennis McKenna:

 

http://paratopia.org/?page_id=10

 

I like Paratopia, it has a good mix of humour and scepticism while exploring a lot of ideas. There's an interesting episode on the subject of ayahuasca (the Brandon D one) too.

 

I had such a crazy nightmare when I fell asleep listening to that one. They mention a common theme in ayahuasca trips is a sense that there is some kind of demonic parasite always with us wrapped around our soul that we're not normally aware of, it's so familiar that we don't distinguish it from ourselves. I was asleep as I heard this but lucid and I thought if you can see this demon in altered states perhaps you can see it when asleep so I sort of turned inside my head to look for it, and there it was. I completely freaked and tried to wake up and sleep paralysis kicked in which I interpreted as this demon locking me down as some kind of demonstration of power.

 

Eventually I shook myself awake but I was still convinced it was real and that feeling just gradually faded. I'm still confused as to why I thought it was so real after I awoke. The dreams associated with my sleep paralysis episodes get more elaborate every time.

 

Thanks for that Last Ninja. Very interesting talk from Dennis McKenna. I hope JD and Dr Bubb have listened to it. I think he addresses many of JD's points of scepticism.

Interesting about your dream. I've also had experiences like that before with sleep paralysis and demonic type presences. All pretty scary but also a little exciting.

[last_ninja]

Quantum activists The next "big" thing?

 

And what's a "Reknown physicist"?

 

So Dr. Amit Goswami was a physicist at University of Oregon’s Institute of Theoretical Science for 30 years, and still didn't made Prof ? Interesting

 

Those that either don't understand, or worse, actively try to fool people with quantum theory terms, are peddling nonsense that...

 

 

 

Says it all really doesn't it.

 

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=quantum-quackery

 

"Quantum Flapdoodle"

 

Brilliant turn of phrase from Gell-Mann, (was also known to have an amazing grasp of language and pronunciation).

 

Science is science, philosophy is not. Each has it's place, but don't risk your life jumping out a window when testing which is which

 

Goswami uses the example of traffic lights - if consciousness affects reality, you still can't use your intent to change all your lights to green as this would interfere with the intention of people coming the other way. If there is more than one consciousness in the universe, then reality is a consensus, not something an individual can make up as they go along. A unified, God-like consciousness would have intent that transcends that of individual egos.

[LauraB]

Interesting though. He's not an easy guy to understand. What I thought he was saying is that he had visions during magic mushroom sessions which made him understand what the Mayans understood.

 

What do you reckon? Is there anything worthwhile to be learned from psychodelics? I heard that giving magic mushrooms to the terminally ill had a miraculously positive effect on their psyche.

 

Once one by-passes the tedious three dimensional past present future illusion, then watching the mayans and the evolvement of the microchip at the same 'time' should keep one on a high, until the council tax bill drops on the mat. (The UK can be so relentlessly cloying).

 

With guidance from the elders, one could recall (rather than learn) one's place in the universe with substances; but not in this spiritually bankrupt culture.

Priestcraft has so much to answer for. Technical progress tends to mask the stench of stagnation 'elsewhere'.

However with an eternity to perform in, and the unconditional love of the 'Is', we will all remember, one day.

[drbubb]

"Quantum Flapdoodle"

Brilliant turn of phrase from Gell-Mann, (was also known to have an amazing grasp of language and pronunciation).

JH Kunstler could out-flapdoddle him any day of the week